From: "mihalco" <mihalco@yahoo.com>

Date: January 21, 2010 8:24:29 PM MST

To: Astro_IIDC@yahoogroups.com

Subject: Re: New AstroIIDC user


Hi Mark,

I think you're over-analyzing it!   ;>)

They're both as parfocal (or not) as the other.  This just depends on how well the thickness of the filters is controlled.  The current version of either filter is pretty good with the reflections. Another imager I respect, Greg Bradley (also in AU) says the Baaders work pretty well.  If the Baaders are significantly less expensive in AU, I'd give them a try.

HTH,

Kurt



--- In Astro_IIDC@yahoogroups.com, Mark Gaffney <markgaffney@...> wrote:


Well I`ve bookmarked the Astrodon link on the page below to the E  

series 2 filters to look at later-the Baader link is to Orion which is  

no good to me..The questions are; how important is the parfocal factor  

(the Baader link I found eleswhere dosen`t mention this factor.) & how  

compatible are either of the above with the Scorpion 20SO?


Mark.

On 22/01/2010, at 6:07 AM, Milton Aupperle wrote:


Hi Kurt;



From reading the spec sheet for the Scorpions 1600x1200  CCD, they  

are likely summing 2 pixels on the horizontal lines and then  

skipping each second line.


So that would explain how they get 2x the brightness and why they  

only get about 2x the frame rate.


Also, if anyone is looking at buying a LRGB filter set, check out:


http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/3560557/Main/3556671


which has some good LRGB curve information for multiple filter  

vendors.


TTYL..


On 21-Jan-10, at 11:55 AM, mihalco wrote:


Hi Alan,

Thanks for trying this out!  I finally received my FW 800 to 400  

adapter, and got the same results.  I'm glad this works, as it  

makes the camera more interesting for planetary use.  I also saw  

the 2x increase in senstivity, which is odd, as it should really be  

4x if both rows and columns are binned 2x2.  I'll see if I can get  

a response from Pt. Grey tech support about what is really going on  

here.  FWIW, I updated the 20SO camera firmware to 1.1.0.22 (latest  

on their website), and everything still seems to work ok.   If the  

storms would finish, I'd sure like to try this out on Mars...

Regards,

Kurt


--- In Astro_IIDC@yahoogroups.com, Alan Friedman <alan@> wrote:


Hi all,


Prompted by Kurt's and Milton's posts, I ran a few tests with my  

Scorpion 20SO (October 2007 build) using the 800x600 8 bit and 16  

bit modes (not format 7). Using a stopwatch to time my captures  

for 10 seconds and setting the fps at 30, the actual capture rate  

measured approximately 25 fps in both 8bit and 16bit modes. The  

field of view at 800x600 is identical to 1600x1200, brightness at  

800x600 appears 2x that at 1600x1200, suggesting that pixel  

binning is enabled at this setting.


Thanks for the heads up on this, Kurt. Hoping the clouds pass in  

time to try this setting on Mars near opposition.


best,

Alan



On Jan 19, 2010, at 12:19 PM, mihalco wrote:


Thanks Milton! I'm still waiting on a FW 800 to 400 cable. FWIW,  

the camera I got was packaged in Aug 2007 and has Firmware  

1.0.2.1. The latest firmware on Pt. Grey's website for the  

Scorpion 20SO is 1.1.0.22, which I'll probably load at some  

point. I'll report back as soon as I have it up and running on  

the Mac.

Regards,

Kurt


--- In Astro_IIDC@yahoogroups.com, Milton Aupperle <milton@> wrote:


Kurt;


Two things about frame rate.


It depends on how old your Scorpion is and possibly what  

firmware load

it has.


I have the 2004 and 2008 Scorpion Tech Ref manuals here in front  

of me


For Fixed modes the 2004 models only run at 15 fps maximum speed  

for 8

bit and 7.5 fps for 16 bit at 800x600.


The 2008 models are listed as 30 fps, but there is a foot note  

that

says 25 fps. The 25 fps is technically illegal because it  

violates the

fixed size frame rate rules which are always set to as 1/2 rate

multiples (i.e. 240, 120, 60, 30, 15, 7.5 etc.). Also, because  

it's

not a binned mode, the camera should be limited to what the CCD  

clock

rates indicates it's maximum frame rate is is 14.98 fps.


For Variable modes (Format 7), the 2004 models do not support  

any of

the binned modes (Format 7, Mode 1 or Format 7,2) which are only

listed in the 2008 manual.


So your frame rate mileage may vary depending on what date of  

creation

and what firmware load the camera has.


On a side note, Astro IIDC will likely not allow you to select  

25 fps

as that violates the Fixed Format Spec 1/2 frame rate rules (it  

should

be either 30 or 15 fps). However if you check mark the "Adjust  

frame

rate for 50Hz light sources to eliminate flicker" item in the

Preferences section (see page 72 of the Astro IIDC help / manual  

for

details on what it does) then it may allow 25 fps as a valid  

frame rate.


HTH..


Milton Aupperle




On 19-Jan-10, at 8:57 AM, mihalco wrote:



Hi Alan,

Take a look at the "Standard Image Formats" in this document. You

will see in the table that the 20SO supports 800 x 600 Y16 and  

Y8 at

30fps (really 25fps per the Scorpion Technical Ref Manual).  

This is

not one of the Partial Image formats (mode 7) in the following

table, which I agree max out at 21 fps. I'm using Pt. Grey's

FlyCap2 program from their SDK on a PC which does run the 20SO at

these resolution, bit depth and frame rate. Since I think you  

have

this same camera, how about trying it out with AstroIIDC in  

Format

1, Mode 6 (800 x 600 Y16), and Format 1, Mode 2 (800 x 600 Y8)  

and

see what you get?

Best Regards,

Kurt


--- In Astro_IIDC@yahoogroups.com, Alan Friedman <alan@> wrote:


Hi Kurt,


Per PGR's specification sheet for the scorpion, the frame rate  

for

the 20SO with ROI selection max's out at 21 fps:


http://www.ptgrey.com/support/downloads/documents/Scorpion%20Getting%20Started%20Manual.pdf


Your capture software might allow a faster setting to be  

selected,

but if you try timing a capture and counting the frames, I think

you will find the actual frame rate to be in line with these

specifications.


best,

Alan


<snip>




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Milton J. Aupperle

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Mac Software (Drivers, Components and Application) Specialist

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------------------------------------


Yahoo! Groups Links






Milton J. Aupperle

President

ASC - Aupperle Services and Contracting

Mac Software (Drivers, Components and Application) Specialist

#1106 - 428 Chaparral Ravine View SE.

Calgary Alberta T2X 0N2

1-(403)-453-1624

milton@...

www.outcastsoft.com